What is most sad about this thread is that many unaware readers will read through these posts and will never know the motivations behind the inflammatory and poisonous venom that's been spewed on the unsuspecting. JP has admittedly cancelled and revoked membership priviledges to various members throughout the years. He has his share of enemies as a result. One grandfather called up JP's broker asking that they tell him how many contracts JP trades. Membership cancelled.
Whatever you may hear about JP either on this thread or elsewhere, know this: He talks the talk and he walks the walk. Every trade is spelled out in explicit detail in the training. It is 100% transparent. Every entry to the tick is spelled out in the training. Every strategy is spelled out in the training. Every condition, every rule, and every facet of the trade is spelled out in the training. It is the best $400 training you will ever receive. Ever. Anywhere.
So when posts in this thread suggest that trades during the trial weren't called out in advance for someone who claims to be a grand father- you have to question the legitimacy of their post. For those attending the trial every trade that was taken was spelled out thoroughly and completely in the training. Nothing was withheld over the last month of training. Nothing. Even now, he continues to explain in explicit detail his strategies and trades.
Having read some of these posts and having been in the room for the past month and heard the man trade- question the integrity of the negative posts. If the time should ever come that I find him to be fraudulent and deceptive I promise to jump on that bandwagon of condemnation. But now, having been on both sides, I can promise the unsuspecting reader that those posts are unwarranted and unfounded.
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The ultimate purpose of learning any trading method is to make money. Over the years, no one has been able to prove, including him, his method makes money. As a matter of fact, one member diligently made every trade for over 3 years and could not make a profit. Even his most "lauded" traders had to turn to "scams" to stay in the game, understand these were people that convinced others to join the room and "cheerleaded" JP's expertise. They, even, were left "in charge" when JP was absent. They were regarded as "de facto" experts of his method. These aren't someone's opinions, these are first hand observations.
There is a difference between being negative on the method and negative on the man. Be careful in your assessments.
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You are not qualified to speak for any trader other than yourself. No intelligent person can believe that anyone would follow a losing methodology for 3 years. One month ago, in your initial post, you said it was 2 years this person logged and documented "every" trade. Now a month later it's 3 years? What will it be next week? 4 years?
Who are these scammers? Please enlighten us so as to be wary of THEM as it is not JP. You are obviously a bitter and "bounced" former member. Please provide us with the proper documentation of these scammers and of your claims so that we too may relish in your words of wisdom.
"First hand observations"? of what? Even as a student for a month I have a very good understanding of the setups and entries. Is the market in on this scam as well? It is Market Profile- Market generated information. Did the market falsify the VAH or the VAL? Did the market falsify the dVAH or dVAL? Did the market falsify the first minute of trading for the Opening Range trade? Did the market falsify Single prints? Is the CME in on the scam by providing false Settlement prices? Did the Market not really trade to the weekly highs and weekly lows for the weekly pivots? Please, dispense to us in all your wisdom, how this market generated information is part and parcel of the magnificent scam being orchestrated on us poor and unsuspecting victims to which you are privy.
Sorry, as far as I know, his most "lauded" trader is trading psychologist Dr. Andrew Menaker of Trader Kingdom and www.andrewmenaker.com. Has he been scammed by JP for the 6 years that he's been a member? Is Dr. Menaker in on the scam? Please enlighten us with your wisdom.
The only valid remark you've made is to warn readers to "Be careful in your assessments" about you!
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Relax will you?
Mike just wanted to hear different opinions. There is no need to attack others' people opinions. In the end if Mike really wants to know he will have to pony up the $1200 and be the judge.
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I'll be happy to enlighten you. I'll, also, accept your apology(although, I don't think you will give one). I thank you for not attacking the main point of my post as to the profitability of his method.
If you reread my first post, I said over 2 years....I believe 3+ yrs. is over 2 years. As to why it took 3 years, he believed in JP. As I have said before, JP is very likeable, engaging and entertaining.
The indicted and prosecuted members are: Stephen F. Clifford and Elizabeth Baldwin. They ran separate schemes, both defrauding multiple people of millions of dollars. They both used their connection to JP to further their schemes. You can do your own research to verify their crimes. Each of these individuals were held in very "high esteem" by the other members and used continually as successful examples. I am surprised you didn't ask JP, or he didn't offer, this information.
Market generated information is not what I was talking about. It was his method and trading of that info, I was talking about. Although, JP does not promote himself as a trade calling service, that's the main reason most of the members join. Afterall, you can learn the basics of Market Profile for free, by doing a small amount of research on the internet (even his setups are out there).
It is interesting you don't mention his current 'most "lauded"' (in your opinion) member, is using JP's room to further his own consulting business. Is there a pattern of previous behavior occurring(reread my previous posts)?
One month of knowledge might be eclipsed by someone with years of first hand experience. Attacking someone with your limited exposure (1 month), "as far as you know", might not the be best way to further one's pursuit of knowledge, in my humble opinion.
As to whether, I am "a bitter and "bounced" former member" I can assure I am neither. It is possible to enjoy someone's comments and companionship during the day, without liking everything they do or allow to be done to others. It is possible to separate a man from his actions and appreciate one without condoning the other.
Again, I caution you to "Be careful in your assessments". It is a wise man, who is aware of his own limitations and can use the experience and knowledge of others to better himself.
You are contradicting yourself once again. You said, " The ultimate purpose of learning any trading method is to make money." Now you are saying that someone followed him because they believed in him for however number of years (I'm not buying your explanation) and didn't make money? What did they see to "believe in him" if he wasn't making money?
You are correct, no apology is forthcoming as none is warranted. You make a number of grand and sweeping generalizations about others to which you are not qualified to be making. You speak for others as though you have the right to.
I do thank-you for posting the names of the alleged scammers. That is a genuine service to readers of this thread and of this forum.
Once again, you speak for others motives for joining the room- to make it into a trade calling service and "that's the main reason most of the members join." You are, once again, not qualified to speak as to why others joined the room. You are obssessed with making grand and sweeping generalizations about other traders and their motives. Please stop. Mike asked for "direct experiences" with JPJ Trading. He did not ask for opinions and hearsay. Your "thoughts" of JP should be educated and informed decisions based on personal experience.
One month of personal experience is better than however many number of years you are ascribing to this month- of hearsay. Let that members voice be heard and let him post his results on this thread.
What I have witnessed over the last month, is the same I witnessed in the first week, JP makes money and a lot of it. While he has several losses his wins have by far- by far- exceeded his losses both in win/loss and in risk/reward. It is for that purpose that all but 10 of those that initially joined for the training are coming back the second month. I got a great education and I made money- a lot more than I lost. This is my "direct experience."
The following user says Thank You to Aragorn for this post:
I am sure to further the causes of fairness and credibility you will, be happy, to provide detailed and verifiable proof of your claims. You can be that member whose voice can be heard, but only with real proof and not personal attacks.
Is there a spreadsheet of some kind with the trades posted that newbies could look at?
If so are there some trades that show a better performance than other types of trades?
Ex. Does the 2 I.B. trade show better results than the OR trade?
Are there more details that can be shared?
He was unable to find any meaningful statistical edge, over time, for any of JP's setups.
It should be noted that Steidlmayer, the creator of Market Profile, has recently said "time format tools including Market Profile and moving averages have lost their value in today's electronic markets." If the guy that created it doesn't think it has value in today's market, I say "be careful!!!"
(Listen for yourself to his August presentation at the CME, if you doubt the quote. It is also obvious MP was designed for use on commodities, with finite supply and demand; as opposed to index futures that in theory have unlimited supply, as they are settled for cash as opposed to actual delivery. This can lead to a profound difference in the make-up and behavior of the markets.)